The newly appointed Apostolic Nuncio to Nigeria, Archbishop Michael Francis Crotty recently visited the Catholic Archbishop of Lagos, Most Rev. Alfred Adewale Martins as part of his familiarization tour of the dioceses in Nigeria. He visited a number of places including the St. Finbarr’s College, Akoka, Divine Mercy Catholic Church, Lekki, and the Lagos Resource Centre (formerly the Nunciature). In this interview with Very Rev. Fr. Anthony Godonu and Mr. Tony Agbugba, Archbishop Crotty spoke about the role of the Church in nation building and how the church in Nigeria can grow from strength to strength. Excerpts as edited by Rev. Fr. Mike Umoh.
Your Excellency, can we know the purpose of your visit to the Archbishop of Lagos and by extension your visit to the Lagos Resource Centre?
As you know, I arrived in Nigeria just over two months ago, 23rd of October 2024. I then expressed my desire to start getting to know the church in Nigeria, I expressed the desire also to visit the dioceses as soon as I could. I strongly believe that the best way to know the reality on the ground, is to visit. So, I’ve already visited some dioceses; Abuja, Enugu, Onitsha, and Makurdi. Now I have the opportunity to visit Lagos. I’m very grateful to His Grace for his time and for showing me round some parts of Lagos Archdiocese and in particular the Lagos Resource Centre which has, of course, a particular connection, given that it was the former Apostolic Nunciature to Nigeria, and residence of the former Apostolic Nuncios. So, I was particularly interested to see what had happened to the structure in the intervening years and to learn about your work. I thank you very much for the presentations from the various people this morning, recounting the activities of the Resource Centre and all that has happened in the past 20 years or more since it was handed over by the Apostolic Nunciature to the Archdiocese. It is also good to know the vision you have for the future.
What are your hopes for the future growth and development of the Church in Nigeria?
Well, I’m just getting to learn more and more about the Church in Nigeria. The things I see are largely beautiful and positive. And I suppose, the first is the abundance of vocations to the priesthood and to religious life, especially a lot of vocations to the sisterhood which I consider to be a great blessing for Nigeria. And Nigeria has been, in the history of the church, evangelized in a relatively short time; maybe about 150 years. But already the country is contributing its role to the Universal Church. Presently, there are a huge number of priests and sisters working in many different parts of the world. It is really a wonderful thing that Nigeria is making its contribution to the Universal Church. That is something I am very pleased about and would like to see developed further.
The great gift of the faith is not something that we receive and keep to ourselves, it’s something we continue to give. I can see this already in action here in Nigeria. Nigeria, of course, has a growing young population and so it is good to learn this morning from the Resource Centre about the role that it is playing in evangelizing the youth. I consider it very important that the Resource Centre is paying particular attention to youth development because of the association of this building with Pope John Paul II who resided in these very room, where we’re having this interview, during his first papal visit to Nigeria in 1982. And of all the popes, he (Pope John Paul II) was the one with the greatest initiative to institute the World Youth Day in December 1985, celebrating the very first World Youth Day in 1986, just a few years after his first visit to Nigeria. The World Youth Day has been a lasting legacy of Pope John Paul II. And next year we will already be celebrating 40 years of the World Youth Day celebrations.
And so, I think, more than ever, the Church has to pay particular attention to evangelizing the youth because it’s so important for the future of the church. I think some people have already expressed concern that maybe when young people are going abroad and losing contact with their families and their communities, there’s also a risk that they would lose contact with the faith. But there’s a positive dimension to this migration. Even in my own country Ireland, I see where there’s a lot of Nigerian immigrants over the past 20 years – including a generation of Nigerian Irish who have been born and raised in Ireland – who bring their Nigerian vibrancy and joy of celebrating the faith to the parishes that they belong to.
So, I think that is a positive thing, you know, and it’s a good reminder to us who are getting a little older to have new Catholics coming among us who are bringing joy and vibrancy of the faith to remind us of what we once had.
Thank you, Your Excellency. Looking at the Nigerian situation, there are a lot of challenges at the moment ranging from insecurity, corruption, and economic hardship. And, I’m sure your presence in Nigeria will want to bring some hope to the faithful. This is the jubilee year of hope, and then everybody is looking forward to how things can be better than the way it is. So, what are your thoughts about these challenges we are facing and how to give hope to Nigerian citizens?
Well, first of all, the very first thing we need to do as Christians, as Catholics, is certainly to pray. To pray for God’s intervention concerning all the ills in society. Insecurity is an issue that concerns a lot of people. We need to pray for the conversion of the hearts of those who do evil things, between kidnappings and killings, because they are happening more frequently than they should. They shouldn’t happen at all. So, one case alone is one case too many. We must pray for the conversion of those persons.
We need to also pray for our political leaders, that they may always be guided with wisdom and work always for the benefit and good of society and for the safety and protection of the people. And I think also as Catholics we have our social teaching of the Church which calls us to be involved and being committed to being good citizens and to play our role in society. Thus, at every level we should bring our faith into action, by using the institutions that are already there in society.
In every part of the world, democracy can be imperfect. Many countries have challenges, so democracy is always a work in progress, at different levels from the local level up to the national. So, I think it’s very important for Catholics to be engaged and to work for building up a better society by bringing the values of the Gospel to society because we have a wonderful story to tell and to give witness to.
Your Excellency, what role do you think the Church can play in promoting peace, justice, and reconciliation at this present time?
Well, just to concretize the roles that I mentioned already, the Church has the role to be prophetic, to bring the message of the Gospel into society. Traditionally, of course, education has been one of the great approaches of the Church to inculcate values. The educational schools are open to everyone, so I think that helps. People are educated side by side and they grow up, side by side. That fosters good relations. So, while the Church needs to be courageous and prophetic, her role is not to be political. That role belongs to the laity. The laity needs to be involved, engaged in society, and play their part. So that’s very important. The importance of being engaged, not expecting somebody else to solve everything.
And, I think, from my very limited experience, that Nigerians have a great can-do approach and a great sense of initiative. And even at the church level, I’ve seen the great initiatives that people take at the parochial level in building churches, which show that people have a great can-do spirit. So, we need to harness that strength. I’ve also seen the great resilienceof people during the economic hardships of recent times, and the church has constantly been involved in charity, helping the people in need. Ultimately, the long-term goal is to be transformative and to be engaged.
Your Excellency, I want to take the questions numbers five and six together because they seem to be in the same category.
And that will have to do with interfaith relationships because you are the ambassador of the church, the Holy See in Nigeria. One of the intentions of the church is to see how we can have a united front with other religions to be able to promote human dignity peace and coexistence in Nigeria.
So, what would you say are the steps that are in place or that are going to be in place to be able to foster that relationship with other religions in Nigeria in terms of interfaith?
Well, first of all, I think it’s very important to say that in most places, and also in Nigeria, that these relations already exist. I mean, at the local level. As far as my own role, I will continue to encourage that and,representing the Holy Father at a universal level, I will certainly be bringing into contact the initiatives of Pope Francis in fostering good relations.
In his pontificate, the Holy Father has reached out a lot, for example, to Islam, and fostered good relations which is a very important testimony and witness. Generally, the form of relation varies from place to place. The experience of Catholic and Muslim relations in Burkina Faso is very different from what it is here. Even in Nigeria, such a vast country, it also depends on the regions that you are in. So, I think where there are good relations in one part, it could serve as a model for fostering better relations in another part. But ultimately, it is very important for the bishops as leaders to engage with leaders of other religions because it sends out a message to the respective flocks. The visibility and the gestures of exchange of visits can have a great effect on setting an example.
I guess these are some of your major roles as the representative of the Holy See in Nigeria?
Yes. My role as a representative of the Holy Father is also to foster relations between the Holy See and the local church. So, this is primarily my role. Getting to know the reality on the ground helps me in that regard. Because so far as the Holy See through the Pontifical Mission Societies is still helping the church and its different outreaches and different roles. It is important that I know and meet people, and also see what is being done. Hence, this morning I’m visiting here at the Lagos Resource Centre, and I have also visited St. Finbarr’s College, Akoka both of which greatly witness to what the Archdiocese is doing in the field of education.
We have to build on our strengths, and I think that the Lagos Archdiocese has great strengths in the field of education at the primary level, at the secondary level and now I see that they are making strides also into the tertiary level because yesterday afternoon we had the opportunity to visit Augustine University, Ilara, Epe.
And I think that’s also very important because just understanding the statistics, that there are only 500,000 third-level university places for Nigerians, and each year there are two and a half million applying for admission. So, if you’re lucky, you will be admitted; a one in five chance. So, there is a huge, huge demand for university education. And I think this is the next frontier of education, because education has always been a way of forming the individual and inculcating values. The Catholic school system has also been a veritable way of evangelization.
So even in the Catholic university setting, of course, it’s opened to all faiths, but it can also be an opportunity for people to come to know Catholic Church in an adult setting, in an adult environment and also inculcates faith. This is important in a university setting in the context of values, moral values, ethical values because we are preparing for the future. Many of Nigeria’s future leaders will be the ones that will now be formed in our universities.
Going further, the church must have a very long-term goals. You set goals for what things will be like in 10, 20, 50 years. So, I think that’s also important, having a long-term goal. And education is for a lifetime. As I commented this morning at St. Finbarr’s College, we had some of the old boys who were there. And they just passed through St. Finbarr’s for five years, and they have said that the formation they received in those five years was crucial for their whole life and their professional careers afterward. So, that is the power of education. I think that the Church has been encouraging the church in Nigeria to build on its strengths and it has great strength in education. But given the new frontier of third level education, it’s a huge area and I think they will need resources for that.
Are there any specific areas of focus or priority you may wish to suggest for the church in Lagos Archdiocese?
My priority now is just to get to know the church in Nigeria and get to know its strengths. However, we want to see the church moving ahead, strong and developing in that. And the church should also identifyits needs. I mean, I think that’s the important thing. And I believe that the bishops in Nigeria are engaged in this process and are having discussions about identifying the needs of the Church. They see the new challenges that are arriving. Sometimes it can take a while to identify them. We live in a fast-changing world. In other parts of the world, there has been a terrible secularization, and abandonment of religion, and of the faith. Nigeria is not like that, thank God. But sometimes we have to learn from what’s happening in other parts of the world and not rest on our laurels butbe ready to address issues and try to anticipate them. I would also say something at a personal level, coming from Ireland, because now Ireland, which has a very long history of missionary tradition and deep attachment to the Catholic faith is now becoming a very secularized country; with people abandoning the faith.
This has been happening for the last 20, 30 years. So, I think it would be important for the church in Nigeria to build on its strengths, but also to be careful and see what has happened in other parts of the world.
And we should not take things for granted. To guard against things and maybe to sometimes address the problems before they even arise. So, you know, as I said, I’ve only just been here two months. Some people here and there have hinted at a few areas that could be problematic. But we’ll see about that. But I think the most important thing is being aware of the spirit of the age in which we live and the challenges that it presents.
And so, something that Pope Paul said, is that every generation needs to be evangelized. We are constantly evangelizing. So that’s why I think that the universities and third-level education are a new frontier for evangelization.
